Men

Thoughts on Jordan Peterson (II): “Back to the Plantation, Bucko!”

One of the most glaring issues with Jordan Peterson is that he is completely oblivious with regards to how men get fucked over by contemporary Western society. Heck, he is complicit, calling MGTOWs “pathetic weasels”, and backpedaling after getting some backlash. Peterson’s solution for men is that they should climb “dominance hierarchies” and thus perpetuate a system that sends men into the meat grinder.

Western society shows utmost contempt for men, particularly white men. We get told that it is impossible that there is discrimination against white men because we are the oppressing class. Sure thing! Obviously, no single diversity hire ever took a job for which there were dozens of more qualified men available. There is not just discrimination in the workplace, we also get a lot less support at every stage of life, while there is no shortage of support in whatever form for women. Heck, we even have a two-tiered legal system in which women get a slap on the wrist for murdering their child, while men get locked up on false rape accusations. What’s the solution to that, according to Peterson? That’s easy, just take on more responsibilities, marry some thot, and if you get divorced and lose custody of your children as well as half your assets, don’t complain because this means that you’re pathetic and weak.

The reason men drop out of society, to varying degrees, isn’t so much that they are all shirking responsibilities. They simply increasingly realize that the path society tells them to walk down to ends, for the vast majority, on the chopping block. If anything, I have much more respect for the guy who makes a living but doesn’t strive too much because he realizes that he will get screwed. Instead of chasing after the carrot on the stick at work, he does an okay job, but otherwise does whatever he wants.

Peterson made it to the top in his profession, being a tenured professor. This seems to blind him to the fact that even the very system he is part of is set up to exploit the young and naive. It’s arguably a lot worse in a field like psychology or the social sciences, where there aren’t so many outside employment opportunities than in more technical subjects where you can tell your professor to go fuck himself if he makes unreasonable demands on your time. Society is largely organized in a pyramid structure. Who is going to climb to the top? The best, you say? Nah, first there needs to be an available slot and then you can hope that the corruption of the system does not keep you from advancing. Good luck making it as a non-leftie in academia, or climbing the ranks in an MNC if your boss’s boss has a nephew who’s looking for a job.

In short, pyramidal systems are (almost?) by design built to screw over the lower ranks. If you’re not at the top, you’re in a lower rank. In order to advance you are supposed to pay your dues and work hard. You’re told that your hard work will eventually be rewarded. It may. However, by the time you’ll find that out, you will have missed out on a huge chunk of your best years. If things don’t work out so spectacularly well on the job for you, then why don’t you just settle down and have kids. Jordan Peterson certainly supports that idea. However, before you do that you should realize that the trade-offs are immense. You’ll eventually sacrifice your entire life for others. It’s work and family until you die, bucko! You normally don’t work just for fun, but in exchange for a paycheck. That’s a huge chunk of your time right there. You still have your evenings and weekends, right? Nope, not if you get a wife and kids. That’s perfectly laudable if you adore your wife and want to have kids with her, but having a wife because society tells you to? Marrying because you got shamed into it by society? Give me a break.

The problem with betting on a family is that the deck is stacked against men to an absolutely ludicrous degree. There are very few Western jurisdictions in which I would get married. Laws are one thing. The quality of the women is another. Have you ever heard Jordan Peterson tell women to get their act together? No, me neither. A large chunk of women in the Western world are complete garbage. As a first approximation, look up obesity figures, and that’s all you need to know. Whereas in days past, the average wage slave would at least get a slim wife, today the outcome is quite different. I’m fortunate that I’m tall and have a few things going for myself, so I could tap into the comparatively small pool of desirable women. (Yeah, I’m dating a stunner who is young enough to be my daughter. Thanks for asking.) On the other hand, if I could only get average-looking women and desperately wanted to fuck, I’d much rather close my eyes and plow a dude instead. Just walk around in your city, look at the typical woman there and ask yourself why any sane guy would work to financially support her. It’s a completely bonkers idea.

If you follow the standard blueprint, you will live your entire life for someone else: the government, your employer, your family. That’s probably hard to see if you’re a tenured professor who has great flexibility and can largely do what he wants. I would be very interested to hear what the many once-promising and hard-working psychology postdocs who got chewed out by the system and ended up wasting half their life chasing an elusive dream would have to say to that. To make it even better, let’s say they also got married and divorced from the typical Western woman. In case it’s not obvious: I’m claiming that Jordan Peterson is oblivious to the fact that he’s the embodiment of survivorship bias. Heck, throw in the apex fallacy as well. He worked really hard and got rewarded, so he thinks that if you work really hard, you’ll get rewarded, too. What you should do instead is look at the expected outcome. For the average guy, the expected outcome is a nasty “shit sandwich”, and if he dares to do things he enjoys, instead of giving his all at his job at BigCorp, until the next wave of mass-layoffs comes, and financially supporting a whale of a wife, he gets shamed by society and told that he is reckless and irresponsible, a loser, neckbeard, and basement dweller. The gynocracy would much rather have him make more money so that he can pay more taxes so that there can be more money for welfare payments from Daddy Government.

Jordan Peterson wants you back on the plantation. I, on the other hand, enjoy sitting back and seeing the numbers of Men Going Their Own Way swell. The smart man today unscrupulously plays the system that is designed to subjugate him. It is the logical choice.


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43 thoughts on “Thoughts on Jordan Peterson (II): “Back to the Plantation, Bucko!”

  1. It sounds like youre speaking to white men here. Then my advice is for them to man up. Toughen up just a bit more. Who knew that white privilege would disappear in the future, everybody except white guys. Imagine the life of an asian guy in China. How intense do you think the competition in that “hierarchy” has been for centuries. But we asian guys just manned up like real men. We also suffer quite alot of abuse from an early age on due to retarded asian upbringing yet still survive, we are survivors.

    Winning, and I guess if white guys check out, asian guys will be winning more.
    I respect somebody alot more if they do their very best, though. I dont think you should persuade white men to be mediocre.
    Sure China will save the world and bring prosperity to all of humanity even lazy white men, but it will be boring without competition. You dont want to win every single time, it leads to complacency, which may be the real problem here(too much privilege enjoyed for too long)

    1. Asian men have been raised to be obedient and just take all kinds of abuse, which is also reflected in typical Asian parenting today. I don’t think the typical Asian adult is a survivor. They tend to be rather meek creatures who sometimes almost seem to lack free will.

      I’m not promoting mediocrity, but if someone tells you to compete in a game that is rigged, you may as well walk away. Also, people need to learn to recognize shaming language for what it is and brush it off, instead of trying to please others.

      1. Great article!
        (The reason men drop out of society, to varying degrees, isn’t so much that they are all shirking responsibilities. They simply increasingly realize that the path society tells them to walk down to ends, for the vast majority, on the chopping block.)
        Spot on!

      2. That is clearly a case of selecting the worse example of Asian parenting(as if it’s something homogenous across Asia to begin with) in order to prove a point.

        Much like, one could take those western parents as an example, who divorce at the slightest hint of dissonance or another-tasty-option-out-there leaving their kids to virtually fend for themselves, while they keep fucking all over the place like pigs. These kids attain “freedom” before they ever get an opportunity to understand what it truly means, and their cocky “boldness” is a mere slavery to drugs,booze and random fluid-exchange.

    2. It’s not the competition that got tougher, it’s the prizes that got unappealing.

      As Aaron hinted, just looking at your “potential prizes” by walking down the street is enough to dissuade you from playing the game.

    3. Jon: There is a difference between man up and bend over. I do not fear competition from Asian men. Heck i’m even moving to Asia. And i have no trouble competing there at all. The real trouble in the Western world is that men have to compete for women with the government. And without any reward for it. Why would any man want to sacrifice himself for a society that exploits him. Why would any man sacrifice himself for a woman that exploits him. Without getting any reward or even the smallest bit of gratitude or respect for it. Is that what a real man does? Bend over and take it holding a flag in his hand? Fuck no! Thats the behaviour of a broken horse. That’s what they want men to be. A broken horse with blinders on. That can be exploited as tax cattle.
      I would prefer a Spartan death over a life like that. I would never submit to those terms.

  2. There are quite a few challenges maybe coming here in the interim though before China is ready to save us. Real men should work hard and prepare for the worst. Not coast by playing video games.
    Think about the resurgence of fascism in the age of Trump, climate change apocalypse, babyboomer retirement and pressure on pensions(although alleviated by immigration), total financial collapse due to lazy rich capitalists greed blowing bubbles.

    A smart man invests in China. Buy China index stocks. Very cheap valuation. Very safe.

    1. Jon: (A smart man invests in China.) I invested in China. And made some good money from it. But maybe you should lower your expectations a bit Jon. I still haven’t made my first billion. And i started investing in China a long time ago. And it’s not like China is the only possible place for investment. There are other opportunities out there.

      1. Ben, men who pay taxes are not cattle, but heroes. It is more heroic to always strive, and not checkout, which is giving up what a coward does. Sacrifice IS heroic. Its part of a heros journey. Thsts why I will proudly pay my taxes once I become a billionaire. Because Im a hero and never give up.

        Also, Give your china investments just a few more years. The undervaluation should be so big you are getting a fat dividend or am buying for P/C is 5. Contrast that with USA P/C of 25, while Chinas prospects are superior, as it has communism instead of fascism or freemarket capitalism.
        Markets can be irrational in the short term but in the longterm they fix themselves. This is a major arbitrage.

      2. Yarara, typical uninformed response. Looks like you havent actually researched chinese stocks. No 1 rule of investing is buy low sell high.

        You would have discovered china is cheap. Low valuation is an objective verifiable fact. Couple that with omnipotent central planners and its a recipe for many gains. Simply buying cheap already creates a good margin of safety against losses.

        But I notice it quite alot sometimes on these blogs, irrational men rejecting objective truth because of some (misogynistic or antichina) bias. Even though China is the most exceptional and indispensable country in the world. But I guess cognitive bias is going to be ingrained in humanity for still a long time to come (except in yours truly because of my high IQ). sigh, ppl do not learn from history. Humanity needs to stop making the same mistakes over and over again.

      3. Jon: (hsts why I will proudly pay my taxes once I become a billionaire. Because Im a hero and never give up.) With that attitude you’ll never become a billionaire. Even becoming a millionaire can be a challenge without a little tax evasion.

        Yarara: (Hey Jon, I have a golden bridge on the moon for sale. Interested?) LOL good one.
        The day Jon becomes a billionaire. I’ll build a great statue of him next to it.

      4. Ben, I dont need tax evasion. I got cheat codes. That China arbitrage is one of them. And I gave it to you for free, arent you thankful? China is still cheap, even though it looks like what I was talking about has already started last year.

        Ill let you know when the next global recession starts (hint: not this year, if my calculations are correct)

        You dont need to make good decisions in investing. You can win by simply avoiding the really bad events.

      5. Premature, grasshopper… Its way too early to tell.
        Its just a minor move from 0.03 to 01btc,its basically nothing.

        I sense you are easily excited, so that is dangerous. No. 1 rule of investing is you verify everything yourself, doubt everybody. You dont just trust random anonymous guys like me, you dont just buy on somebodys tips unless you
        Can follow and understand the reasoning. You should learn critical thinking like I did and master your emotions like fear and greed for longlasting success.

        Crypto is great practice because its tulip bubble^100.

        Keep in mind im just a crypto newbie. That call was just based on TA mostly.
        The China call is based on battletested FA so its alot safer.

      6. Also I actually found some flaws in my reasoning, so Im no longer really sure.

        But in any case, crypto will be greatest wealth transfer of our lifetimes, so does it really matter what you buy, the tide lifts all boats I guess… You cant attribute skill to luck.

        Always expect a multiyear bear market that filters out the metoo cryptos, so watch your risk.
        But the biggest risk is not a government ban, but a viable government sponsored crypto.

        I expect us to pay with crypto one day.

  3. Just walk around in your city, look at the typical woman there and ask yourself why any sane guy would work to financially support her.

    It’s quite depressing… walking around and see what the average woman is. In my part of the world… 15 years ago, most girls in their twenties looked hot, both physically and in terms of their “energy” (feminine stride etc).

    Now they are all like trolls… in both physical appearance and demeanor.

      1. Please don’t tell me that westernization is the reason.
        Or that things were better under eastern european socialism/communism.

        The question is: Why is the west so fucked?
        Not: Why did eastern Europe westernize?

      2. Of course things weren’t better. My grandpa was sent to gulags for not being a communist.

        When I say “westernization” I do not mean “become more free market”. I have no idea why you read it that way. Plenty of free market countries in Asia.

        If anything, western countries are less free-market than.

        I’m referring to the negatives such as pop-feminism.

      3. “When I say “westernization” I do not mean “become more free market”. I have no idea why you read it that way. Plenty of free market countries in Asia.

        If anything, western countries are less free-market than. ”

        Thank you for clarifying.
        I guess I read it that way, because I just got back from holidays there and can’t stand the now 40-60 year olds fantasizing about how good it was then, when all they did was delegate all responsibility to the state.
        A corrupt state with a bankrupt business model that is.

        I agree with the West not having free markets. Crony capitalism and too much regulation in the wrong places killed it.

    1. Some women can “maintain” their looks in their (early) 30s if they eat little (or just raw vegetables), don’t have kids, smoke a little (to kill their appetite)…

      …BUT as Aaron discussed his “women meets wall” articles, their 20s were truly their invincible power period. Just like real estate or stock markets seem to only get more expensive and valuable as time goes on, women treat their youthful beauty as a never-ending bull market.

  4. ” (Yeah, I’m dating a stunner who is young enough to be my daughter. Thanks for asking.)”

    — hahaha…by that, I assume over 18 and under 25 🙂

    I am sure you get shaming by womyn who call you a “pedophile”…and too afraid and weak to deal with a strong, mature independent whoa-MAN.

    1. Used-up women were shaming me for my ex-wife who was just 8 years younger than me. I’m used to it. I was actually called a pedophile to my face once by a woman roughly my age after I turned her down by telling her that I’m dating a girl 10 years younger than me, a 19-year-old. She was not happy to hear that.

      1. Im not old enough to be (legally) dating girls who could be my daughters, but I have gotten some harsh words from my sister because I have been dating girls younger than her.

        (I’m early ’30s and currently dating a joyful 21yo who fucks like a pornstar, thanks for asking)

  5. “I, on the other hand, enjoy sitting back and seeing the numbers of Men Going Their Own Way swell. The smart man today unscrupulously plays the system that is designed to subjugate him. It is the logical choice.”

    –> So Aaron, how does the smart man play the system?
    For example, is there some kind of baseline here? Such as: Not get married? Use seeking arrangement dot com? Save money?

    I mean, there are a few MGTOW sites out there where you can glean some ideas…but are such sites run by “role models”? After all, if you are truly MGTOW, do you go out and blog about how your MGTOW?!

    1. One issue with the MGTOW community is that it is full of men who supposedly want to go their own way but instead want others to tell them what to do. Still, there are some very good insights to be gained from the system. One is “ghosting” and living a life largely outside of society. Schopenhauer wrote about that 200 years ago; it’s an idea I got exposed to in my teenage years. Another important insight is that you can’t depend on external validation for your happiness (that’s probably worthy of a separate post).

      More concretely, carve out your niche. A key aspect is to limit your liabilities and dependencies. How you concretely want to play the system depends on your skills and interests. Let’s talk about a more concrete case: assume you were always a pretty smart student, so “the system” tells you to keep piling up degrees. You do that because you want validation from society. Besides, you know people not nearly as smart as you who got PhDs and became professors, so wouldn’t they look down on you? If you depend on external validation, you then end up working in ever-more arcade fields of intellectual inquiry. Instead, why not get a regular job, put in your 9-to-5 and do your thing in your spare time. (Some people promote living in the third world and running an online business, but I can’t quite take that seriously.) I recall reading a very detailed discussion on some MGTOW forum once about becoming a doctor versus a registered nurse, provided you’re good enough to get into medical school. In the US, registered nurses are very well paid, so that seemed like a very good choice. Doctors, on the other hand, may have a great lifestyle, but they pay a heavy price.

      Also, if you are not happy with the women around you and the legal system, the smart choice is probably not to marry.

      1. 1 – limit your liabilities! This cannot be stressed enough.

        2 – do not depend on external validation

        In this day and age, one of the clearest ways to demonstrate tbis is to steer clear from social media. No FB, no twitter, no instagram, nothing. Been there done that, 99% of what people publish is worthless.

        3 – if you wanna game the system hardcore, I suppose you can live below radar and evade taxes. 🙂

      2. Living outside society sounds a lot like the Varg Vikerness approach. I’m not sure I’m ready to collect my own drinking water but I guess I’ll have to rethink my opinion on this lifestyle. 😅

        About social media, for the most part I’m a passive member and only follow what others post. I’d say that only Twitter deserved my continued use (as a news feed) if it wasn’t run by the same kind of leftist numbnuts as Facebook.

  6. “A stunner who could be my daughter”.

    From your comments and Gal’s, I assumed your age around 38, and hers around 23. Yeah, a male can father a child at 13 years old, but that phrasing usually conveys an age difference of around 20 and above. LOL

    Pedophile? Dating EXCLUSIVELY women under 18 but above puberty would make you an Ephebophile, which is hardly unnatural biologically speaking.

    1. I’ve seen that phrase being used for smaller age gaps, in the sense of biological possibility. (My girlfriend also objected to that phrase.) Anyway, we’re a few more than 13 years apart, easily enough to get washed up Western women hot under the collar. She’s getting the occasional spiteful look from Western women for snatching such a tall white guy, which I find rather amusing.

  7. Let’s listen to JP and certainly not make decisions for ourselves, our future wife will make decisions for us as well anyway. Mortgage, job, clothes, cars, babies (which may or may not be ours, who knows ?), and later, divorce and alimony.

    1. JP and other traditionalist believe that working for a woman and family is a investment. That if you work hard when you’re younger. And invest time and money on the wife and kids. That this will pay of when you’re older. And that men owe society. The problem with this is as Aaron said. (Men simply increasingly realize that the path society tells them to walk down to ends, for the vast majority, on the chopping block.) This investment that JP wants us to make is hardly ever paying off. It’s just a spending these days. Because relationships simply don’t last anymore. And when the wife decides that she’s not happy. She will get most assets and the children. Plus alimony/child support. You are probably to end up having worked for nothing your entire life. The marriage contract is just a really bad contract. And there is no benefit for a man to it. No benefit at all! The modern marriage contract is like signing a legally binding blanc paper.

      1. I recall some interview where JBP talked about his wife, I think they were neighbors as kids. From the conversation you could infer that neither he nor she probably slept around much (if at all) before they married. It wouldnt surprise me if his extended social circle showed the same bias. His experience of marriage is probably skewed to the traditional side.

        On the other hand, he is well aware of how society has changed in a lot of ways, so I dont understand how he can be so blind to this issue. He regularly remarks how 80%-90% of his audience are men.

      2. He doesn’t even seem to understand why his audience consists mostly of men. Hint: women get handed everything on a silver platter. Men don’t.

        Peterson also has some videos online where he mentions how “creatively” his wife insults him, which he seems to find amusing.

  8. Aaron S. Elias: (MANHe doesn’t even seem to understand why his audience consists mostly of men.) He’s learning that slowly. It’s not that he’s stupid. He just comes from a different environment. He has more and more encounters with troubled young men lately. And it’s affecting him. It’s not that he doesn’t care. He just doesn’t really get it when it comes to modern women. He understands that society is alienating young men. And he speaks out against it. But when it comes to women he doesn’t really say that much. He doesn’t address their behaviour in any critical way. And it’s understandable from his position. If he would tell women to stop acting like prostitutes. He would give the left the ammunition they need. They would destroy his life and likelihood.

  9. Markets clear; the average man gets the average woman. Male obesity rivals female obesity. Girls are outperforming boys in school. Aren’t you comparing MGTOW with “Going Galt”?

    When people married young, it made sense for one partner to guarantee the other in exchange for career sacrifices. But I’m not sure this is right when partners are older.

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